I have a weightlifting spreadsheet with weight on the vertical axis and reps on the horizontal axis. The value of each cell is the estimated 1 rep max if I accomplish that lift. In theory if my e1RM is 100kg then I can lift any permutation of (weight,reps) that have the same e1RM. This is akin to knowing Pareto Frontier of my current strength.
I use conditional formatting to color cells according to the probability that I can lift them—if I lifted 50kg for 10 reps then I can definitely do 50kg for 9 reps, so that cell is green. But if e1RM(50,10) > e1RM(40,15) then I can probably do that too so it's light green. The visualization naturally becomes Pareto-like.
If I'm feeling strong I can aim for higher weight, lower reps. Or if I'm feeling weak I can close out a (weight, reps) that's below my current e1RM but I haven't accomplished yet. The end result is that I'm always "accomplishing" some sort of PR no matter how I feel.
Misread the title and got excited about a Pareto font, that is, the best possible font (presumably: distinct l/I, O/0, scores within error margins of the top readability and reading speed scores, widely available, etc.)
Maybe in vein but did anyone already figure this one out? The closest I got was PT sans, open-licensed commissioned by the Russian ministry for communication (I found it surprising that a country that doesn't use Latin script made the best font!), but it's not widely shipped so you need to figure out how to include font files whenever you want to use it
I didn't know fonts can have options. Another learning curve on how to enable that in Latex/Html/Libreoffice/anywhere else I use fonts ^^'. But still helpful to know about!
ss02 disambiguation seems to be the one I'd be wanting to turn on, with tnum for monospace numbers being a good option as well that I hadn't even realised I wanted from a font!
ChatGPT 5.6 Luna on the right (cheaper) cover most of the frontier, with a point for Deepseek flash, and higher performance overlapping heavily between 5.6 Sol and Fable.
That DeepSeek point will probably move back towards Luna as deepseek announced a "significant" price increase coming to their API [1], which kind of demonstrates that beating the Pareto frontier is where the difficulty actually is).
Pareto front sounds like an interesting way to optimize, but it suffers from the curse of dimensionality just like anything else.
As the number of objectives (dimensions) increases, the number of samples you need to cover the frontier increases exponentially. You will very rarely find solutions that actually dominate other solutions in many practical optimization scenarios. With 2 dimensions you have a 25% chance of domination. With 10 dimensions it's a .098% chance.
The most useful cases I've seen tend to occur where we just optimize for two things at once. The chances of domination are high, it's easy to visualize and very efficient to implement. As we get into higher dimensional spaces, things get weird really fast.
I am training for a marathon, and, as I increase both by distance and pace, I am always excited when I have a "Pareto run": a run along the Pareto frontier of me trying to maximize distance and speed.
When explaining it to some coworkers, I stumbled on a fairly intuitive explanation: "I've run farther before, and I've run faster before, but I've never run _this_ far, _this fast."
There was some pushback about why not just call it a PR (personal record), but I would only use that term for fixed distances (1mi, 5k, 10k, etc.) or a consistent route that I've run many times before. Nobody would say "I set my 7.40 mile PR today." More importantly, it misses the comparison to all farther (and faster) runs—it's not exciting to set a 5k PR just because you've barely run that distance before, and the pace is actually slower that a 10k you've done.
(Had a Pareto run of 7.40 miles @ 6:28/mi last week!)
Found this to display the optimal LLM choice while building evalry. It's such a useful tool, not only for thinking about it, but for visualization, too.
Nice, this is exactly what I use for the multi-objective optimizer on a quantum network simulator I'm building — scoring topologies on fidelity/latency/success rate tradeoffs.
My thesis many years ago was on multi-objective optimization using evolutionary algorithms (in my profile), and maintaining a wide pareto front was what most algorithms (like NSGA-II) were attempting. If all individuals cluster around a small area (in for instance a weight/strength tradeoff), you will quickly get stuck. So should select solutions to keep for further search along the whole front (for instance some solution that is very strong but unfortunately also very heavy). Maybe keep some of them as candidates even if worse (not part of the pareto front), just to keep that part of the search space alive and avoid local optima.
Of course, what's hard anyways when you have a good set of solutions that are pareto optimal, is to then choose between them. Especially as the dimensions (objectives) grow. In my example we can end up with many variants of strength/weight trade-offs that each are optimal, which one to choose?
I think the one from hugging face is much clearer, albeit its an arena metric and a bit tricky to find the pareto view. Look for the the top Navigation Bar
(Agent Chat Code Image Video). Chat -> (dropdown) Text -> (Side panel) View as Pareto.
If we have a set of things (e.g. language models) and some measures we care about (e.g. cost, speed, whether weights are open, scores for a few benchmarks, etc.), then some of those things will be "pareto optimal" (see below) and some won't. The "pareto front" is the subset that is pareto optimal.
Some thing is "pareto optimal" when there isn't another thing that's AT LEAST AS GOOD in ALL measures, and BETTER in at least one way. For example, if we say there are no ties (for simplicity), then the cheapest language model is pareto optimal; the fastest model is pareto optimal; those which score highest on each benchmark are pareto optimal; and so on.
Tradeoffs can also be pareto optimal: for example, if the cheapest model is also slow, then there will be more pareto optimal models which are "cheapest for their speed"; and so on for other tradeoffs (e.g. fastest that achieves a certain benchmark score; cheapest model with open weights; etc.).
If you're making a decision about which thing to choose, you only need to care about those in the pareto front (since, by definition, anything that's not pareto optimal is objectively worse on at least one measure).
Pareto optimality does not compare one measure against another: something that's 10000x slower can still be pareto optimal, if it's 1% cheaper than the alternatives. To pick a "best" thing, you could give a weight/importance to each measure, and combine them into an overall score: but that's subjective, and might vary between people and tasks. In contrast, focusing on the pareto front is a way to ignore those things that will never be the best, regardless of weighting.
I honestly think the wikipedia article is too complicated. My own image example here as an another attempt to explain: https://imgur.com/a/5ZQIJDb
Mapping the cost of something (like an algorithm), and the time it takes (so lower is better for both). 1, 3 and 5 are all optimal in their own sense. No one is strictly better than the other, just different tradeoffs you have to choose yourself. However, you would never choose 2, because for a lower cost you could get the same result choosing 3. Same with 4, 6 and 7, they all have something that's both faster and at the same time just as cheap you could choose.
If you optimize one criterion, it's simple: lowest is best or highest is best.
If you optimize multiple criteria, all optimal trade offs between any of the selected criteria are "best" in some way.
When you have a tradeoff between two parameters, which points dominate the others in the sense that you can't choose another point without getting less of one of the parameters.
"what's the family of optimal choices when you have multiple dimensions to rank on?"
Say a race vehicle has acceleration, top speed as defining parameters. Some are slow but accelerate hard, others need a long time to reach very high top speeds. Others are in between, or just flat out bad at both.
The pareto frontier is the set of vehicles that are best: pick one from the frontier and you can be sure that for it's given top speed, none accelerate faster. And vice versa, pick one with a given acceletation and you are sure none have a better top speed
The Pareto points are where you sacrifice the least of anything to get the most of everything.
There's the saying about buying computers. Good, Cheap, Fast, pick any two. That's where you would prioritise.
If someone makes something that better, cheaper, and faster, or even pretty close to the best on two of those and clearly better on the other. It's a Pareto point.
Over time computers are getting better, cheaper and faster (software notwithstanding). The leading edge of that advance of all of the things is the Pareto front.
> a Pareto front represents the set of solutions where no solution outperforms any other solution in the set at every objective
I do not believe you are correct when you say
> something that better, cheaper, and faster, or even pretty close to the best on two of those and clearly better on the other. It's a Pareto point.
Since that would outperform on every objective
GP's point that it's prioritisation does not seem incorrect to me. Prioritisation involves considering trade-offs of various approaches and deciding which aspects & attributes to optimise for, at the expense of others.
I use conditional formatting to color cells according to the probability that I can lift them—if I lifted 50kg for 10 reps then I can definitely do 50kg for 9 reps, so that cell is green. But if e1RM(50,10) > e1RM(40,15) then I can probably do that too so it's light green. The visualization naturally becomes Pareto-like.
If I'm feeling strong I can aim for higher weight, lower reps. Or if I'm feeling weak I can close out a (weight, reps) that's below my current e1RM but I haven't accomplished yet. The end result is that I'm always "accomplishing" some sort of PR no matter how I feel.
I call this e1RM Bingo.
Maybe in vein but did anyone already figure this one out? The closest I got was PT sans, open-licensed commissioned by the Russian ministry for communication (I found it surprising that a country that doesn't use Latin script made the best font!), but it's not widely shipped so you need to figure out how to include font files whenever you want to use it
Anyways I'll namedrop Iosevka as perfect monospace font for working on 13" laptop
"The Pareto Front today claimed responsiblity for...."
https://rsms.me/inter/
ss02 disambiguation seems to be the one I'd be wanting to turn on, with tnum for monospace numbers being a good option as well that I hadn't even realised I wanted from a font!
ChatGPT 5.6 Luna on the right (cheaper) cover most of the frontier, with a point for Deepseek flash, and higher performance overlapping heavily between 5.6 Sol and Fable.
That DeepSeek point will probably move back towards Luna as deepseek announced a "significant" price increase coming to their API [1], which kind of demonstrates that beating the Pareto frontier is where the difficulty actually is).
[1] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2026-08-06/deepseek-...
As the number of objectives (dimensions) increases, the number of samples you need to cover the frontier increases exponentially. You will very rarely find solutions that actually dominate other solutions in many practical optimization scenarios. With 2 dimensions you have a 25% chance of domination. With 10 dimensions it's a .098% chance.
The most useful cases I've seen tend to occur where we just optimize for two things at once. The chances of domination are high, it's easy to visualize and very efficient to implement. As we get into higher dimensional spaces, things get weird really fast.
When explaining it to some coworkers, I stumbled on a fairly intuitive explanation: "I've run farther before, and I've run faster before, but I've never run _this_ far, _this fast."
There was some pushback about why not just call it a PR (personal record), but I would only use that term for fixed distances (1mi, 5k, 10k, etc.) or a consistent route that I've run many times before. Nobody would say "I set my 7.40 mile PR today." More importantly, it misses the comparison to all farther (and faster) runs—it's not exciting to set a 5k PR just because you've barely run that distance before, and the pace is actually slower that a 10k you've done.
(Had a Pareto run of 7.40 miles @ 6:28/mi last week!)
Example: Which LLM gives me the best ELI5 explanations for a given price. https://evalry.com/benchmarks/explain-like-i-m-5-321
Of course, what's hard anyways when you have a good set of solutions that are pareto optimal, is to then choose between them. Especially as the dimensions (objectives) grow. In my example we can end up with many variants of strength/weight trade-offs that each are optimal, which one to choose?
https://artificialanalysis.ai/#intelligence-comparison-tabs
https://huggingface.co/spaces/lmarena-ai/arena-leaderboard
Some thing is "pareto optimal" when there isn't another thing that's AT LEAST AS GOOD in ALL measures, and BETTER in at least one way. For example, if we say there are no ties (for simplicity), then the cheapest language model is pareto optimal; the fastest model is pareto optimal; those which score highest on each benchmark are pareto optimal; and so on.
Tradeoffs can also be pareto optimal: for example, if the cheapest model is also slow, then there will be more pareto optimal models which are "cheapest for their speed"; and so on for other tradeoffs (e.g. fastest that achieves a certain benchmark score; cheapest model with open weights; etc.).
If you're making a decision about which thing to choose, you only need to care about those in the pareto front (since, by definition, anything that's not pareto optimal is objectively worse on at least one measure).
Pareto optimality does not compare one measure against another: something that's 10000x slower can still be pareto optimal, if it's 1% cheaper than the alternatives. To pick a "best" thing, you could give a weight/importance to each measure, and combine them into an overall score: but that's subjective, and might vary between people and tasks. In contrast, focusing on the pareto front is a way to ignore those things that will never be the best, regardless of weighting.
Mapping the cost of something (like an algorithm), and the time it takes (so lower is better for both). 1, 3 and 5 are all optimal in their own sense. No one is strictly better than the other, just different tradeoffs you have to choose yourself. However, you would never choose 2, because for a lower cost you could get the same result choosing 3. Same with 4, 6 and 7, they all have something that's both faster and at the same time just as cheap you could choose.
Say a race vehicle has acceleration, top speed as defining parameters. Some are slow but accelerate hard, others need a long time to reach very high top speeds. Others are in between, or just flat out bad at both.
The pareto frontier is the set of vehicles that are best: pick one from the frontier and you can be sure that for it's given top speed, none accelerate faster. And vice versa, pick one with a given acceletation and you are sure none have a better top speed
It’s really that simple.
Eschew obfuscation.
The Pareto points are where you sacrifice the least of anything to get the most of everything.
There's the saying about buying computers. Good, Cheap, Fast, pick any two. That's where you would prioritise.
If someone makes something that better, cheaper, and faster, or even pretty close to the best on two of those and clearly better on the other. It's a Pareto point.
Over time computers are getting better, cheaper and faster (software notwithstanding). The leading edge of that advance of all of the things is the Pareto front.
> a Pareto front represents the set of solutions where no solution outperforms any other solution in the set at every objective
I do not believe you are correct when you say
> something that better, cheaper, and faster, or even pretty close to the best on two of those and clearly better on the other. It's a Pareto point.
Since that would outperform on every objective
GP's point that it's prioritisation does not seem incorrect to me. Prioritisation involves considering trade-offs of various approaches and deciding which aspects & attributes to optimise for, at the expense of others.